Tap Tempo Unreliable

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mehrdadp
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:34 pm

Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby mehrdadp » Mon Mar 11, 2013 3:31 pm

I have mapped button 5 on my softstep to the "Tap" in the Abelto Live Transport. Tap button on the ableton reacts to switch #5 on my soft step when I press it relatively hard. However, the midi message to Ableton is not timely. By that I mean, that I tap at about 80 BPM but ableto software tap tempo jumps erratically from say 77bpm to 180 bpm, to 212 bpm and on the 4rth tap maybe jump to 140 bpm. What the heck is going on?! Could somebody help me figure out how to have steady and reliable tapping on the soft step into ableton live "Tap " transport button? I spent the whole day unsuccessfully trying to figure this out.
MacBook pro, OS 10.10.5, Apple Duet, Ableton Live 9, SoftStep 1 in hosted mode, Amplitube 4.
krishkal
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:27 am

Re: Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby krishkal » Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:45 pm

I have never used tap tempo, but here is how I would approach the issue:

1. Ableton Live itself is a bit erratic
2. Softstep is not registering your taps correctly
3. variable latency in sending the MIDI message

For #1, I would eliminate Softstep completely, and just send the tap information from the computer keyboard (I think Ableton allows this. Try tapping with your finger and see if Ableton is holding a steady beat.

For #2, you mentioned you had to press "hard". Maybe you should play with the Gain setting to get it so you can press comfortably and have it register your press.

If 1 & 2 seem fine, then you are basically left with #3. One way to check that out is to use a MIDI monitoring software on the computer and watch the MIDI messages, and see if they seem jerky when you press a steady beat. For Mac, you can use MidiPipe, and for PC you can use MIDI-OX. Or, come to think of it, you can just use the SoftStep program itself, and look at the incoming message, I think (have not used it in a while). Or, maybe Ableton has a MIDI monitor display.

Hope this helps.
TheSupport@KMI
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:30 pm

Re: Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby TheSupport@KMI » Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:21 am

I'm going to guess that the likely cause is you're in Hosted mode but have "Input: SSCOM Port 1" turned on in addition to the proper Hosted mode input ("SoftStep Share" if you're on Mac, something else like MIDI Yoke or LoopBe if you're on Windows). If this is the case then what is happening is that when mapping the SoftStep to tap tempo, Live is "learning" one of the raw CC values instead of the correct, intended MIDI message. When in Hosted mode, the SoftStep will output its raw pressure data as CC messages and send it to the editor. The editor then molds this data into the correct, useable MIDI messages and sends them out over a virtual MIDI port (SoftStep Share, MIDI Yoke, etc). If an application is listening to the SoftStep's raw data it will make mapping things a very tough time.

So if you are actually in Hosted mode, open up Live's MIDI Sync preferences and turn OFF the Track and Remote options for "Input: SSCOM Port 1" and see if that helps things.

Tap tempo in Live is a big fan of MIDI notes, so I recommend using the default "NOTE" scene that came with the SoftStep — or a custom scene where a key just outputs a simple note will do just fine as well.

And as krishkal said, tap tempo in Live isn't perfect.
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mehrdadp
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:34 pm

Re: Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby mehrdadp » Mon May 20, 2013 4:20 pm

I think, like you said, key on my Softstep is sending the raw data to Ableton. I proved it by turning off the modline entirely. I was still able to map the key (#5 for me too) to the tap tempo in Ableton control bar. This midi mapping acts up without regards to what is in the modline.
I am having the same problem with tap tempo jumping bmp drastically:(:(. I tried with mapping it on a key on my midi controller keyboard and it worked perfectly. no jumping bpm. but I'm a guitar player and i need to do it on Softstep.
Has anybody found a solution to this problem? pleasse share. Or a regular footswitch is the way to go with Ableton? since midi mapping in ableton is listenning to the raw data sent to it and not the modlne commands.
When I was mapping key5 on my softstep to ableton, I noticed cc numbers 76, 77, 78 and finally 79 are registering randomly as I push gently to harder. These should be the raw cc datas from key number 5 on the Softstep out to the computer.I am using it in hosted mode.


5 minutes later:
Following your suggestion, I was able to get one-tap-per-push. I turned off SSCOM1 "Track" and "Remote" in Ableton preferences and respectively activated them on Softstep. I need the modline on now. It is sending a midi noterather than the cc. Ableton tap tempo seems to work good with the note command in this case. Bravo.... I have been mingling with this fucking tap tempo for over a year now. Voila!
MacBook pro, OS 10.10.5, Apple Duet, Ableton Live 9, SoftStep 1 in hosted mode, Amplitube 4.
mehrdadp
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:34 pm

Re: Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby mehrdadp » Sun May 26, 2013 1:30 pm

TheSupport@KMI wrote:I'm going to guess that the likely cause is you're in Hosted mode but have "Input: SSCOM Port 1" turned on in addition to the proper Hosted mode input ("SoftStep Share" if you're on Mac, something else like MIDI Yoke or LoopBe if you're on Windows). If this is the case then what is happening is that when mapping the SoftStep to tap tempo, Live is "learning" one of the raw CC values instead of the correct, intended MIDI message. When in Hosted mode, the SoftStep will output its raw pressure data as CC messages and send it to the editor. The editor then molds this data into the correct, useable MIDI messages and sends them out over a virtual MIDI port (SoftStep Share, MIDI Yoke, etc). If an application is listening to the SoftStep's raw data it will make mapping things a very tough time.

So if you are actually in Hosted mode, open up Live's MIDI Sync preferences and turn OFF the Track and Remote options for "Input: SSCOM Port 1" and see if that helps things.

Tap tempo in Live is a big fan of MIDI notes, so I recommend using the default "NOTE" scene that came with the SoftStep — or a custom scene where a key just outputs a simple note will do just fine as well.

And as krishkal said, tap tempo in Live isn't perfect.



You are right about tap tempo in ableton not being perfect. My I ask you this? Now that I have turned off my sscom and connected through softstep share mixer; does't that also duplicate with Mac's IAC port? In that case can I just turm off the SS Share and solely use the IAC? would Softstep and/or the Editor loose any functionality through IAC midi bussing?
Thank you Support!
MacBook pro, OS 10.10.5, Apple Duet, Ableton Live 9, SoftStep 1 in hosted mode, Amplitube 4.
TheSupport@KMI
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 12:30 pm

Re: Tap Tempo Unreliable

Postby TheSupport@KMI » Tue May 28, 2013 1:15 pm

Well, SoftStep Share doesn't necessarily "duplicate" the IAC bus, but it is the same concept. Both are just virtual MIDI ports that you can use to send data between applications. You can use the IAC driver bus instead of SoftStep Share if you like, you'll just need to make sure all of the "device/routes" in the SoftStep Editor are set to IAC Driver Bus instead of SoftStep Share. That way the modlines will output to the IAC bus and not SoftStep Share.
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